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My Quick LRI Proton Pro Review


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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 1:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
My light looks identical to the red Led being off center in the cutout hole. This is not nit picking or being critical.


I think so, but you are not listening to me... and I am fine with that.

Quote:
Does anybody know the operational temperature limits of the Proton Pro?
I do know first hand the lithium battery works perfectly at -38 Fahrenheit. The manufacturer of the battery says it will work till -40.
Question is what are the limits of the light?


Sorry, but WE don't have the design specs. Why do you think we do? Perhaps you should ask LRI.

(The lithium cell is an LIR-2450.)

You want us to answer your questions. So answer one of mine, IF you can do it without using the words "fit and finish"!

How much are you willing to pay, until you determine, "That's perfect enough for me."? I would really like to hear you say a dollar amount. How far would you go, seriously, to center that light? Just that, nothing about the tail cap or the threads or anything else.

Put answer here: $___.__

My guess is that you won't, because it would mean that now the shoe is on the other foot. It puts you in the position of deciding just where the line is drawn. Just as LRI has done. A manufacturing call.

Respectfully
Mr.X

P.S. It just hit me. You don't even have a Proton Pro do you? No wonder you don't know what you are talking about. You don't have the Pro!

That picture you are talking about is depicting the area in front of the LED that was required to get the reflector out of the way of the Red LEDs beam path. That is in front of the LED, not beside it. The angle of the shot accentuates that area and you see it as you do. Centering has nothing to do with it at all. Next time... aw, never mind.

Happy Holidays
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007Runner



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 2:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr.X wrote:
Quote:
My light looks identical to the red Led being off center in the cutout hole. This is not nit picking or being critical.


I think so, but you are not listening to me... and I am fine with that.

Quote:
Does anybody know the operational temperature limits of the Proton Pro?
I do know first hand the lithium battery works perfectly at -38 Fahrenheit. The manufacturer of the battery says it will work till -40.
Question is what are the limits of the light?


Sorry, but WE don't have the design specs. Why do you think we do? Perhaps you should ask LRI.

(The lithium cell is an LIR-2450.)

You want us to answer your questions. So answer one of mine, IF you can do it without using the words "fit and finish"!

How much are you willing to pay, until you determine, "That's perfect enough for me."? I would really like to hear you say a dollar amount. How far would you go, seriously, to center that light? Just that, nothing about the tail cap or the threads or anything else.

Put answer here: $___.__

My guess is that you won't, because it would mean that now the shoe is on the other foot. It puts you in the position of deciding just where the line is drawn. Just as LRI has done. A manufacturing call.

Respectfully
Mr.X

P.S. It just hit me. You don't even have a Proton Pro do you? No wonder you don't know what you are talking about. You don't have the Pro!

That picture you are talking about is depicting the area in front of the LED that was required to get the reflector out of the way of the Red LEDs beam path. That is in front of the LED, not beside it. The angle of the shot accentuates that area and you see it as you do. Centering has nothing to do with it at all. Next time... aw, never mind.

Happy Holidays

How about this: Since your not helping and have nothing relevant to say. Don't reply to any of my future questions and concerns and I will do the same for you.
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Crizzly



Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 145
Location: Oregon, USA

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

007Runner wrote:
Take a look at the picture of the reflector area in the nice blowup shot nascar did in his review. My light looks identical to the red Led being off center in the cutout hole. This is not nit picking or being critical. When the naked eye can pick up something in a quick glance as being off center, it has to be bad.

So, there's an off chance we just aren't understanding the words you are using to describe what you are seeing. Is there any chance that you can post a nice tight photo with arrows pointing at what you are seeing and how you'd like to be seeing it? I mean, if while looking directly at it, there is too much gap to one side or another, then the solution of simply rotating the reflector to center it as you wish still stands. If there is a gap toward the center or outer edge of the light that isn't to your liking, perhaps the LED on your unit is leaning inward/outward respectively. Again, you could correct this with a pencil eraser simply enough if it bothers you enough.

Perhaps what you are attempting to suggest is that the hole cut in the reflector was too large for your liking, and you'd like it to fit more snugly around the red LED? Given the reflector is simply dropped atop the LEDs, I can see the randomness of placement with a 'larger than need be' hole being potentially disturbing to someone, but like with gun mods, if the owner doesn't like something, they are welcome to resolve it for themselves. Some may choose to replace the GitD O-ring with a black one. Some may attach a key ring to the tail cap. Others may remove the belt clip. The point is, if something bothers you for your use needs, correct it for yourself. Don't rely on folks selling exactly what you (and potentially, *only* you) need, as they have to have a general market to think about in order to actually turn over product.

I look forward to seeing a diagram or to hear if you can resolve the mod needed yourself (and followed with the expected post saying "hey, blah was a bit annoying me, so I did blah to fix it like this! Thought you'd like to hear my tip in case you had the same issue!" as this is the normal behaviour on this [and most other] forum[s]).

Cheers man! Smile
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007Runner



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 6:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a cutout in the reflector for the red LED. I am not complaining about the size of the hole. I just want the red Led to be reasonably centered in the cut out hole.

While looking directly at it there is too much gap to one side. The reflector just needs to be turned a little. I would be afraid to try this because I don't want to break it, and I'm not sure how to get it apart.

The tail cap threads were not cut as accurately as they should have been, so I am sure it is just a matter of time before they get cross threaded. Other people share this concern as well.

My point is the manufacturing of the quality control needs to be improved. I should not be expected to cut new threads or have to turn a reflector to line things up. It should come to us in better shape. I really don't think this is nit picking or being too critical. Just a normal expectation.
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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You see, 007 refuses to answer my question. He has apparently not seen the Pro first hand and apparently does not realize what he is seeing in nascar's images. (Or I am not seeing what he is talking about.) But he continues to avoid my direct questions and I must wonder why.

I looked at the image and as it appears, there is a gaping hole next to the Red LED. If that gaping hole that he is seeing in the picture was actually beside the LED, I would jump right on that band wagon with him and shout it to the world that it is poor workmanship indeed. However he is being fooled by that image and refuses to even think that just maybe he could be wrong. If it turns out that I am wrong, then I will be the first to admit it.

If you look down the barrel of the Pro and that view is directly in front of the light, the gap(if any) is less than 1/2 of a millimeter. The gap he is seeing, is the removal of the reflector that would otherwise be blocking the beam of the Red LED. I admit that it is huge, but it has to be there to allow clearance for the beam to go straight out of the front of the flashlight. The reflector has a very steep angle and would be in front of the Red LED, if it were not allowed for.

I can supply an image(or two), if someone has a way to host it for me. I have no place to host an image. All that would be left to do is get my image(s) to some person so they could put it where it could be accessed. This is another reason we are having so much trouble communicating our thoughts. It is because neither of us had seen what the other is talking about. After looking at nascar's image, I could see what 007 is talking about. The angle of the shot has mislead him.

I really do not hate 007( as Perfectionist would have you believe), but I don't know another way to get through to him. I can make two images, one with what I believe he is seeing and one with what I believe he is not seeing. None of nascar's images shows the Pro from a point exactly inline with the front of the Pro and in particular, the Red LED.(no offense nascar, your images are just fine. They simply don't illustrate what I am trying to show to 007.)

What I DO hate is all this animosity and tenacity. I really wish to get it resolved, no matter who is wrong about it. If we both can see the problem, then that might provide the answer. Part of the problem is that I don't think he even has a Proton Pro, or he wouldn't be on this tack.

Sincerely
Mr.X

P.S. I apologize to the group for my fervor. I just can't stand it, when a person spouts off about poor workmanship and hasn't even seen the device in his hand, to support his position.
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007Runner



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mr.X wrote:
You see, 007 refuses to answer my question. He has apparently not seen the Pro first hand and apparently does not realize what he is seeing in nascar's images.

I looked at the image and as it appears, there is a gaping hole next to the Red LED. If that gaping hole that he is seeing in the picture was actually beside the LED, I would jump right on that band wagon with him and shout it to the world that it is poor workmanship indeed. However he is being fooled by that image and refuses to even think that just maybe he could be wrong. If it turns out that I am wrong, then I will be the first to admit it.


Sincerely
Mr.X

P.S. I apologize to the group for my fervor. I just can't stand it, when a person spouts off about poor workmanship and hasn't even seen the device in his hand, to support his position.


My last post described everything perfectly. There should be no more question as to what I am talking about.. If I could rotate the reflector a little the red LED would be centered just fine.

You have called me a liar at least two times. Try to embarrass me on the forum. You also derive great pleasure in stating that you do not even believe I own a Proton Pro.

If I contact LRI to read them my sales invoice that Rudy in customer service sold me on Dec 20 and received on the 22nd would this shut you up permanently?

Don't respond to any of my future posts, threads, questions, anything. I promise you I will be more then happy to do the same.
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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would not even think of trying to embarrass you. You simply need no help. You are doing fine on your own.

I went back and read your posts from your beginning and you have been nothing but a pain in the forums side, since your first message was posted. I even found one of your posts where you claimed "...it's my thread...". The forum belongs to all of us. Not just you.

If I concede that you have a Proton Pro, "would this shut you up permanently?"

Now lets you and I just stop... and let cooler heads prevail. I say that, knowing full well that you won't. Rolling Eyes

See you later, I hope you have a pleasant New Year.

Mr.X
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Crizzly



Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 145
Location: Oregon, USA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

007Runner wrote:
There is a cutout in the reflector for the red LED. I am not complaining about the size of the hole. I just want the red Led to be reasonably centered in the cut out hole.

While looking directly at it there is too much gap to one side. The reflector just needs to be turned a little. I would be afraid to try this because I don't want to break it, and I'm not sure how to get it apart.


Ah, great, this is easy and exactly what I needed to hear to help ya. Smile

You know how you unscrew the tail cap? try exactly the same hand positioning on the lens end of the body. Have faith that some part will unscrew, as the seam isn't really visible. Basically, it's the entire flat bit just before the ridging starts. When the cap itself comes loose, hold it so the lens is pointing toward the desk/bed/lap/etc. Do this over something as the lens reflector will simply fall out, and you don't want to hunt for it on the floor. Smile
There really isn't any sort of trick to unscrewing the lens cap end other than trusting it'll open as easily as the tail cap.

Once inside, you'll see the reflector just lays there with the LED's poking thru the holes. Your red LED should be upright and fine, so don't think ya need to bend the leads or anything lest you damage the connection somehow. To address your preference, all you really need is the tiniest bit of tape or glue to secure the lens, and prevent it from rotating under the GitD O-ring as you tighten the lens cover back on. I'll leave the particulars of securing it to your own exercise unless you need more direct help here.

Once secure, you put the lens cap back on. Now, I know some folks [ie: one old coworker we affectionately nicknamed "Ape Arm Ed"] who just reef on things to get them to close. He was a cross-thread-accident-waiting-to-happen with even a mason jar. Very Happy Seriously tho, we had to teach him the simple trick of putting caps on more easily/delicately:
-- place cap atop threads
-- turn the 'wrong way' until it clicks and seats in an upright position (basically, you are pushing down lightly, yet unscrewing the cap until you literally run off the end of the threads. This *always* will seat the cap/screw/etc in the perfect orientation so you can then safely screw it in/down)
-- gently twist it onto the base; if there is undue resistance, 'unscrew' as above an additional quarter to half twist and try again. In general, it should be about as smooth to put on as it was to take off.

This is one of those things that once you do every time, it's hard to understand that some folks don't know/use this same simple technique. Kinda like pouring liquids from a glass container using a rod across the opening (usually seen with chemicals in a beaker at a lab) -- too elegant to not use! Smile

It may seem as tho I was being well, whatever, but I assure you that I've never ever cross threaded something since I started using this plan as a kid...so I figure everyone else does it this way, but apparently some don't, so I gift the technique to those who may like it. No implications intended...

Quote:
The tail cap threads were not cut as accurately as they should have been, so I am sure it is just a matter of time before they get cross threaded. Other people share this concern as well.


Using above, this should never be an issue either. Works for all materials and thread grades. Fwiw, I just recalled where I found the most use of the technique: those crappy milk bottle threads we have in the US... my whole family always would destroy the threads before the gallon was gone.. Ever since I taught them all the "half a backwards turn first" technique, it was much more tolerable!

Quote:
My point is the manufacturing of the quality control needs to be improved. I should not be expected to cut new threads or have to turn a reflector to line things up. It should come to us in better shape. I really don't think this is nit picking or being too critical. Just a normal expectation.

...and this is the exact place you tend to lose us. Nothing wrong with that, just established where thoughts diverge. Smile I (we?) don't fear the cross threading due to our knack/technique/whatever with putting finely threaded stuff back together, and therefore don't have the 'worst case' ideas about having to re-mill threads into the light. As for the second placement part, clearly everyone here doesn't care as much, and were somewhat surprised you didn't take it upon yourself to correct yourself. Of course, your post I am responding to addressed that you were, in fact, uncomfortable with the beginning steps to do so. I thank you for sharing that fact so we could walk you thru what many of us feel is a trivial step -- we forget that others may not have the same base knowledge or comfort level as the rest of us sometimes... Again, nothing wrong with that, but it's kinda crucial info needed for us to give the needed help. One other possibility is that I know some of us have had times in our lives where we had to fend for ourselves, 'make due' with what we could, or some other variant of 'survive' in less than perfect situations. Usually folks who have had that in life will ultimately be really good at assessing "a problem I can easily correct" and "a problem that shouldn't have occurred in the first place"... after all, this is really the distinction you seem to be trying to make on our, well, honestly, somewhat deaf ears.

With that, I hope your issues may be resolved with the light... if you wish more advice, please feel free to ask for it ["hey, this doesn't look right... anyone else see this? how'd you deal with it?" is ideal and will get the best response...].

Cheers, and happy&safe new year to ya!
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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 2:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crizzly, It is to your credit, that you are a much more patient man than I may ever be. Good show.

Mr.X
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007Runner



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you for that information. I thought the lens area of the light was a solid piece. I wanted to purchase four more of these units to give as gifts, but the quality control issue really bothers me.

I can now correct the alignment issue, but the tail cap threads still suck. I would have thought by now that these threads would be smooth as silk. A dry Teflon lubricant does make threading a bit better.

Mr. X, just go away. If you dropped dead today, I would not miss you tomorrow.
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Crizzly



Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 145
Location: Oregon, USA

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

007Runner wrote:
Thank you for that information. I thought the lens area of the light was a solid piece. I wanted to purchase four more of these units to give as gifts, but the quality control issue really bothers me.

I can now correct the alignment issue, but the tail cap threads still suck. I would have thought by now that these threads would be smooth as silk. A dry Teflon lubricant does make threading a bit better.

Glad your issue was finally understood, and seemingly you're on the path to resolution. Smile I concur the threads are not the smoothest, but then I've never found threads in aluminum that I thought were adequately smooth either. I chalk it up to the material's feel more than the manufacturing tho. They already did improve the threads once by adding more twists (the first were 'just enough', and there were some issues by a few folks). I've always wondered how to improve aluminum threads...figured it would be some combination of cleaning, brushing, and lube/conditioning... my only fear is that most flashlights need electrical conductivity between cap and base to work properly, so would have to test various lubes' effects before using on a light I liked. Smile

Quote:
Mr. X, just go away. If you dropped dead today, I would not miss you tomorrow.

ok you two.. issue over, and we're finally on (reasonably) good footing once again. Wink Honestly, everyone on any forum is just a screen name to everyone else on the list -- most don't notice if one drops in or out, so really, noone cares about anyone else that much. Laughing [note: there are over 4000 folks signed up for this forum... care to guess how many read it anywhere close to regularly? ...let alone post! heh]

To that end, if *everyone* [me too!] keeps discussions about the lights themselves, their ideas for mods/improvements/future products, asking if troubles we perceive are perceived by others, problems we're having getting the light to do something, stories about how the product helped us when we were in a bad bind, and other 'on topic' stuff, I think we'll all enjoy our time on these boards alot. Smile

Cheers everyone! Happy new year!
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007Runner



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 37

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I unscrewed the lens and tried to put it back together keeping the red Led centered in the hole. I did not have any luck keeping it centered. As you tighten the lens cap the reflector wants to rotate a bit. If the metal reflector had a grove cut into it that fit into a raised piece, or some tits in back of it (tits are like raised nubs that fit into a mating surface) this would hold things in alignment. This would not have raised the cost of the light plus alignment would be assured every time.

Things I did that I never should have had to:
I had to clean the inside of the lens and reflector because of some dust particles and a few small threads stuck to the reflector. The reflector is very shiny now. It was never really that clean to begin with.
The threads are actually very good. I cleaned all the threads up with some rubbing alcohol, and wiped it clean with an optic wipe. After removing the grit and left over aluminum particles the threads are silky smooth. I also put some dry Teflon lubricant on the threads since they were now removed of any lubricant.

LRI should put more effort into the reflector to make sure when it goes together it will be reasonably centered. The rest is to be expected from assembly and manufacture in china.
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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

007Runner wrote:
Mr. X, just go away. If you dropped dead today, I would not miss you tomorrow.


I understand completely. Fair enough.

I hope the New Year brings you long life, wisdom and prosperity.

cheers
Mr.X
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Crizzly



Joined: 13 May 2003
Posts: 145
Location: Oregon, USA

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

007Runner wrote:
I unscrewed the lens and tried to put it back together keeping the red Led centered in the hole. I did not have any luck keeping it centered. As you tighten the lens cap the reflector wants to rotate a bit. If the metal reflector had a grove cut into it that fit into a raised piece, or some tits in back of it (tits are like raised nubs that fit into a mating surface) this would hold things in alignment. This would not have raised the cost of the light plus alignment would be assured every time.


What are you using as an adhesive? Recall I suggested a bit of tape or glue to secure it while tightening. Also, if you're "don't really care" about the GitD o-ring, this is likely what is rotating the reflector, so you could try pulling it out completely [altho, this may keep the reflector from flopping around a bit, I don't know]. But yeah, some sort of sticky under the reflector just up near the lens cap [not down by the electronics] should suffice... maybe a touch of double sided sticky tape? could be narrow enough to fit a 2mm wide piece between the reflector's edge and the neck of the light...

Quote:
Things I did that I never should have had to:
I had to clean the inside of the lens and reflector because of some dust particles and a few small threads stuck to the reflector. The reflector is very shiny now. It was never really that clean to begin with.
The threads are actually very good. I cleaned all the threads up with some rubbing alcohol, and wiped it clean with an optic wipe. After removing the grit and left over aluminum particles the threads are silky smooth. I also put some dry Teflon lubricant on the threads since they were now removed of any lubricant.


I don't think I've ever seen aluminum threads lubed before... so replacing what was likely not there in the first part seems odd. Smile But I'm glad to hear that process worked for cleaning them up, and will likely do similar myself - thanks!

Quote:
LRI should put more effort into the reflector to make sure when it goes together it will be reasonably centered. The rest is to be expected from assembly and manufacture in china.


Other than surgeons and some class10 clean rooms, I've not seen folks clean up after their process nearly as well as you suggest. Smile but, then you're welcome to blame the lack of neatness on whatever you wish [china, men/women/kids as labor, humid/dry country, strontium 90 in the milk, solar flares, pick-your-favorite-god's will, etc], just as long as you realise not everyone else will agree with your guess/opinion/belief. This fundamental mutual tolerance and understanding [some would say 'sensitivity', but that's nearly cliché now] is what founds strong societies.

I could see a nominal 'notch fits here' alignment widget, but as you've seen, noone else seems to care that much about it as it doesn't improve the light's function in any notable way [thus merely a 'cosmetic' fix, which, in a light that will be banged about and used, is silly to folks who will use them as such].

Cheers man, and hope you get that reflector held down to your liking! Smile
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Mr.X



Joined: 01 May 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Portland, Oregon U.S.A.

PostPosted: Fri Dec 28, 2007 6:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crizzly,

After seeing your diplomatic methods with 007, I realize that I could have handled him in a much better way. Admittedly it was hard to let go. I should have taken the higher road. My bad.

Your a good man, Criz

Mr.X
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